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Messages - P A C

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Eastern Sierra Fishing / Re: First Golden Trout for 2017
« on: January 05, 2018, 10:36:48 AM »
Thanks for sharing WSH!

The plentiful larger black marks (spots) are challenging and combined with the darker olive body could suggest a German Brown or Loch-Leven strain - but based on the altitude and the lack of lighter colored halos around the black spots my geuss is -

Either a young Cutthroat or a Hybrid Cutt-Bow?

Whatever it is, it looks beautiful - I hope they are plentiful and grow to large sizes in the 20 Lakes Basin.

All the best, P A C

Strictly Media / Re: 2017 Eastern Sierra Photos
« on: December 22, 2017, 11:04:50 AM »

At this point in the summer of 2017, if you attempted to, did you catch any fish in these lakes?  Sometimes at this stage of thaw, yet earlier in the season of a more normal year, the fishing can be quite good.   :fishing3:

Just wondering..........Thanks!


Strictly Media / Re: 2017 Eastern Sierra Photos
« on: December 20, 2017, 09:58:32 AM »
Wow!  Conditions in July 2017 look more like those for late March or early April in what used to be a 'normal' winter. 

Thanks for sharing!

Anything Goes / Re: Any deals that you couldn't pass up?
« on: December 11, 2017, 09:01:41 AM »
Gary C. -

A little off-topic, and you may know of this based on some of your travels you have shared on this board;

the 'Steep and Cheap' name brings back memories of decades ago where the Slide Mountain/Mt. Rose Ski Areas (never were viewed as 'Resorts'  :lol2:  ) used to use that term as their informal marketing slogan.

If anyone reading this has never been, this/these two Ski Areas used to be separate and competing businesses adjacent to each other along NV Highway 431, aka the Mt. Rose Highway.  The 431 runs between the very southern most point of the city of Reno, NV, exiting off of the 395, and continues southwest over the Mountains and drops into the northeast shore of Lake Tahoe (Incline Village).  The highway is very steep and has a lot of curves on both sides of the mountain. 

The runs were very short in length or duration, however because they are located at the top of the mountains in that area the runs were very steep.  And since each business was relatively small and out of the way, in order to attract locals and UNR students on a budget or little spare time, they had to price the tickets EXTREMELY cheap in comparison to the larger relatively nearby world-class places like Squaw Valley, Alpine Meadows and Heavenly Valley (as they were named back in the day prior to the multi-state multi-resort mergers and acquisitions that have since occurred)

I remember back in the mid to late '80's as the aforementioned big resorts were pricing north of $50 for as single day ticket, Slide Mountain and Mount Rose were prices at about $17!.  Yes, you did get what you paid for, but if you didn't have time or funds to spend on an entire day to justify $50+, these smaller places were in fact - 'Steep and Cheap' and great fun!

Gary - thanks for the info on the website as I had never heard of it before, and the memories that the name pulled out of the deep past!

All the Best, P A C

Strictly Media / Re: 2017 Eastern Sierra Photos
« on: November 15, 2017, 04:16:14 PM »
W S H,

A couple of the many elements that contribute to making your photography and narrative both so incredible and enjoyable to experience vicariously is the 'When' and 'Where' you travel!  As I know from my own experiences over the years - to experience and document so much of the beauty you share with us, you have to travel to some difficult-to-get-to places in sometimes unbelievably difficult-to-get-through conditions.  The risks can be very high, and sometimes the rewards just are not there.  But when they are..........Oh My!  :bowdown:

Thank you again for all that you share with us, and the time and effort you put in to do so before, during and after.   :clap:

Safe Travels to you and your family - each and every time, all of the time.

All the best, P A C

I found this post on another Eastern Sierra climbing oriented site. Hope this is the 'right' or best section for posting it on this board as it is not a trip report and is a form of 'MEDIA'    :-)

Simply, Truly Fascinating. :bowdown:

Anything Goes / Re: Entry into Yosemite could cost up to $70
« on: October 31, 2017, 06:31:34 PM »
When I first heard this on the news either late Friday or on Saturday my first thoughts were:

 - Typical Administrative and PR ploy to release a news item, which will likely not be well received, late on a Friday and hope something else newsworthy develops and overshadows the release by Monday Morning.

 - That as stated in the news story as I heard it, and stated above by Littlefish, the majority of the Funds collected by each park will 'stay' in that park's coffers and budget and are to be targeted specifically for the immediate REPAIR, upkeep and infrastructure improvements in said park.  I thought to myself, well if accurate and it really plays out that way, and we see immediate improvements on currently deteriorating resources, that would really be a great thing.  However I fear delays in application, and final direction, of where the funds go, and that said 'new found money' may be used for FUTURE and NEW developments.  Those are important for the long run, but can be funded in other ways and while more immediately and urgently maintaining and preserving important historical elements of the Park(s).

 - Lastly, I thought about the comparative value of entry after the dramatic increase in price - $70 is a lot of money, particularly for a Government Location allegedly supported by our Federal Taxes at work - however if on average there are at least 3 to 4 people in a vehicle, and many (although US Citizens and pay taxes) are from out of state or are out of country tourists, they are also likely budgeting for some of these expenses. Example -  they likely pay $5 to $10 in one way single trip short mileage bridge and toll road fees elsewhere during their journeys, let alone the additional price of Parking and single person admission ticket pricing when going to visit a for-profit Theme Park(s), Animal Parks, Round of Golf, (even payment for a Guide Service etc.  ;).  Most people are familiar with the cost of at least 3 o 4 people going to see a first run movie in a Theater.   A visit to the park will, in most cases, last longer than 2 1/2 hours and have a far greater experience in general and a likely positive life-long lasting memory.

So I still think it sucks, however I am a realist and try to maintain a positive outlook.  It is unfortunate, however appears unavoidably necessary at this point in our lives and for the future - as long as the money goes where it is supposed to, and quickly.

As stated above - if the money is really and truly being used to fix things in the park(s), and ASAP after collecting the funds, if not in advance based on budget forecasting of increased revenues to be realized in the future, this could be a very good development and may help stop the unaddressed deterioration, and resulting blight in some cases, that is now occurring due to the continued increase in popularity (visitors) in National Parks like Yosemite.  Think of the many simple things like the dilapidated structure around Soda Springs in Tuolumne Meadows and others like that. The decades old sewer systems that don't get repaired, and therefore are turned off, leaving structures unused, and un-maintained to deteriorate further. These should never have been allowed to deteriorate to the level which they have. 

It is unfortunate that the Concessionaire Arrangement does not seem to benefit the park(s) and the paying public at the level it should.  And let's face it, we all know who pays the price - no pun intended.

Just my 2 cents worth and IMHO.


Strictly Media / Re: 2017 Eastern Sierra Photos
« on: October 27, 2017, 09:51:44 AM »

Thank you, as always, for the simply incredible pictures and information. :thanks: :goodpost:

Once again proving the old adage - 'It's not WHAT you know, it's WHO you know'!  THANK YOU  for sharing. :campfiregroup:

I have read books on this area, various articles, the NFS and resort info handouts etc since I was a kid in the early '70s and have NEVER heard any reference to these incredible snow caves in this area. 

Your photo is fantastic! Have you ever offered (or considered offering) to sell them along with an article, etc to a publication like National Geographic or Outside Magazines?

Some of what I find so interesting, if not fascinating, is the amount of visible and apparently healthy 'flora' among the rocks in the stream bed.  Although this is an Alpine area, and the various life in that zone is suited/evolved to handle, survive and prosper despite the harshness and realities of 'life' in this zone, Direct Sunlight is a vital component.  The richness of the greens of the plants in the stream bed are amazing when considering that, even though there may be light coming through the ever-thinning snow bridge, it is not in fact direct, unfiltered sunlight (unless it is perhaps coming in from an open end of the snow cave/tunnel?).

Also the apparent moss on the bottom of the inverted aretes or sun cups suggest enough sunlight is somehow getting through - especially since most that green tinge appears to be at the thickest parts of the underside of the snow bridge - NOT the thinnest.

Your explanation of the warm air flow helps explain why it may be 'warm enough' for plants to grow as well.

Please know that many of us on this board are grateful and very appreciative of all that you share on this board - despite the appearance of a lack of 'activity' or direct responses or replies to your posts - PLEASE keep them coming, :coffee:  :clap:

All the BEST!  P A C

Strictly Media / Re: 2017 Eastern Sierra Photos
« on: October 24, 2017, 09:25:02 AM »
WSH - Wonderful comparative/contrasting photos!  As I've shared, I also have spent a lot (yet not enough) time in the TIoga Pass area over the past almost 40 years now (Yikes!) and love all 3 seasons that it is accessible by car.

I have been up there late in October in non-drought years however never seen Ellery drained so low in October - curious if you were able to see any Fall Brown Trout spawning runs up the inlet and further up into Junction Meadow and up Saddlebag Creek this year?

Or spawning fish staging at the inlet of Tioga getting ready to make their fall run?  I know they are rare, however there a still a few monster size Browns in that lake.  In the previous years, TPR had some beautiful examples of all species which were caught in the area mounted on the support wall between the cafe' and the main store. 

Please keep the TR and Photos coming!

All the best, P A C

Strictly Media / Re: 2017 Eastern Sierra Photos
« on: October 22, 2017, 01:13:52 PM »

WS Hawkins, thanks once again  for sharing these incredibly gorgeous photos of your travels.  Can't wait to read about and see all of the Fishing Trip reports and photos when you are able to find the time to post them. :clap:

I was wondering and hoping that this fall would be fantastic in the Eastern Sierra based on all of the factors from the first 8 to 9 months of the year - glad to see someone able to take maximum advantage of it.   :twothumbs:

Currently don't have the time to research on a map at this moment - is the lake shown in the photo of 'Secret Lake' truly named Secret Lake, or is it one of your 'secrets' ? :reading:

Thanks, and All the Best!


Strictly Media / Re: 2017 Eastern Sierra Photos
« on: September 25, 2017, 04:33:20 PM »
I am truly honored to have guessed that and should have gone with my 'gut' and initial inclination.

The reason I felt so strongly about it being Dana Meadows is I have a memory of a similar view from the Summer of 1983 and also 1995, the last two extremely heavy and late winters most similarto this past winter.

As an FYI and to WSH, you may know this as well, when you enter the park via Tioga Pass and are driving westbound towards Tuolumne Meadows, or are approaching the park exit east bound from Tuolumne Meadows, on the 120 roadway, in Dana Meadows, there is a section of roadway with A LOT of 'old' looking avalanche debris fields spanning from 100 to 200 yards north of the 120 and fanning out into Dana Meadows south of the 120. 

The majority of that Avalanche Debris was from the 1983 winter (actually the spring/summer melt), and I remember the road crew working on that debris along the side of the road as they had cleared it.  There was actually a relatively short stretch of roadway that was down to one lane with alternating one way traffic with a portable timed stoplight for a very short period until they finished the clean up and repairs to the road.  That was 1983.  Don't recall if the stoplight was powered by 12 volt battery or a fuel powered generator - definitely many years before Solar was utilized...

It is both incredibly  interesting and yet somewhat scary to realize we are actually able to experience 'history' like this over the years - I sure don't think or feel that I am any older today than I was 34 (yikes!) summers ago............

WSH - looking forward to your future posts and recaps of your experiences this year, along with your incredible photos as well.

All the BEST, P A C

Anything Goes / Re: posting pics
« on: September 25, 2017, 04:09:40 PM »
WOW!  What a fantastic pic of such a beautiful animal!  Well done!   :clap:

Now if you 'Make it Smaller' due to file size I can understand and appreciate that, however, if you mean by physical size and space in a post;  well IMHO as long as there is no cost or capacity limitations leave it as is!  For this and everyone else's posted images.

However understanding that nothing is 'free' or 'forever', and based on the relatively 'fast one' or less than forthright approach photobucket took, definitely want to protect everyone's investment in time and resources.

just my .02 worth.  :-) 


Strictly Media / Re: 2017 Eastern Sierra Photos
« on: September 25, 2017, 09:51:57 AM »
OK, since it has been a couple of days now and this post has now received over 350 views, but no takers (yet) of your challenge, I will formally stick my neck out with following semi-educated WAGs:

Here is my logic - Based on the date of 1st week of July 2017, the amount and apparent depth of the snow, no visible water, yet no appearance or indications that the wide expanses of white snow are FLAT terrain like would indicate a frozen lake - all look like they have a slight downslope angle to the expanses - based on your personal history of early morning starts to your adventures and generally from a trailhead on the Eastern Side, and that this picture appears to be looking to the West based on no Sun in the distance and the lighting appearing to be before well before noon as well as the vast snow covered range in the distant background of the photo:

WAG #1 - Horseshoe Meadows area/approach trail to Cottonwood Lakes ?  (I have never been to either - yet)

WAG #2 - My first inclination (which is based on other beta gleaned from a couple of your posts earlier this summer) is that this is the Dana Meadows area and photo is taken from a unique position somewhere up above and south of Tioga Pass/ Tioga Lake looking West/Northwest ?  (This area I have visited many times previously over the years)

The confirmed answer from you will be interesting and enlightening. As Always! 

Thanks again for all of your great posts and sharing your images with us!

P A C   :clap: :bowdown: :woot2: :thankyou: :photographer: :twothumbs:

Eastern Sierra Forum / Re: Campground Closures
« on: September 15, 2017, 03:55:05 PM »
As I have learned over the years and from others on this board, the scheduled closing dates have to do wit

 - Temps that will disrupt the Water System Pipes (Freezing)
 - Historical 'demand' and related staffing that is required or available to keep them open
 - Fire Activity in the Area

That being said, here is what I have gathered on the Internet via the Authorize Reservation Company Site:

Rock Creek Lake - scheduled to close Friday Oct 6, 2017
Upper Pine Grove - not reserveable, will need to check with Forest Service
East Fork - to close Monday Oct 16, 2017
Palisades - to close Sunday Oct 8, 2017
Iris Meadow - not reserveable, will need to check with Forest Service
Big Meadow - not reserveable, will need to check with Forest Service

Other resources -   -  if you look around and access each tab on this FB page this phone number is displayed - Call (760) 935-4824 I have not tried calling it

Good Luck!

Eastern Sierra Fishing / Re: First Golden Trout for 2017
« on: August 10, 2017, 09:31:49 AM »
WSH - out of my normal curiosity, can you please share with us at least the general location of this 'Golden Trout gem of a lake over 11,000ft?'

Based on a couple of your recent posts, I wondered if it might have been in the 20 Lakes Basin or more likely up above that area based on the 11K indication.

The small background visible in the photos and the lush Alpine greenery/groundcover suggest it is a beautiful location.

Thanks for all of your posts and contributions of your knowledge and TRs.  Very enjoyable as well as educational.

All the best!  P A C

The potential for a Sierra Grand Slam ++ now in the LLV! :clap: :hiking2: :fishing3: :flyfish:

Anything Goes / Re: how to post pics
« on: July 31, 2017, 04:35:28 PM »
It appears that many of the images posted on this site are now disappearing.......I just read a post about East Fork Campground, then went to Beldingi's post from a few years ago that showed the maps of the RC Canyon Campgrounds and all of the images in her post are no longer visible, yet they were just a couple of weeks ago when I last looked at them.

Like Gary C said about his images now missing from his posts.  How truly unfortunate - so many people have posted so many images for our enjoyment and many appear to now be in jeopardy, if not already removed.

I am sure hopeful that all of the hard work expended and the images posted that WSHawkins , and many others, have shared with us is/are in some way able to be preserved.

Hoping for the best - P A C 

Eastern Sierra Forum / Re: Contacting East Fork camp host
« on: July 24, 2017, 10:39:19 AM »
And he provided it earlier in a post below titled 'eastfork'  :-)         :bowdown:

Eastern Sierra Legend
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Re: eastfork
« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2017, 02:28:16 PM »
Kevin is the manager for all the campgrounds in Rock 760-935-4824   

Eastern Sierra Forum / Re: 7/18 Missing Hiker Alert
« on: July 21, 2017, 11:22:09 AM »

Wonderful to hear of a favorable and safe outcome! 

Thanks, Praise and KUDOS to all of those involved in every level/aspect of each SAR mission.   :clap: :thankyou:

Eastern Sierra Trip Reports / UPDATE Re: Tioga Pass Area
« on: July 17, 2017, 11:01:27 AM »
Check out this article in the LA Times posted July 14,2017 - a couple of incredible photos of TPR and Tioga Pass entrance to YNP and area, along with first hand narrative involving an inside tour of the damage inflicted on the Resort Buildings - apparently more still possible, if not likely, due to current flooding concerns. 

This beautiful building was incredibly well constructed, well maintained and reinforced over the years (several decades). It has withstood incredible conditions during this time.

To have sustained such incredible damage seen in the photos and conveyed in the narrative speaks to the incredible force of this past winter's storms and snow accumulations.  After spending so much time there over the past 35 years I am awestruck.


Eastern Sierra Forum / Re: Missing Hiker 10/17
« on: July 14, 2017, 09:06:42 AM »
I heard about this update on the Radio this morning (Fri 7/14/17) and researched and found the following supporting information.  May Mr. Woodie Rest In Peace and may his family now find closure to this tragic incident.  The fact that his body was apparently located so very close to where they were searching and along his stated travel route must be very frustrating as well to the family and SAR teams that worked so hard at that time.

If this is your first time reading this post/thread I encourage you to read the very well-written, heartfelt story this hiker's son wrote about the life of and search for his father.  This story can be viewed by accessing the url links posted above in Maverick's initial post at the top of this thread.


Eastern Sierra Trip Reports / Tioga Pass Area
« on: July 12, 2017, 03:44:37 PM »
So in living vicariously and also assisting a friend plan a trip, the news for this beautiful area's accessibility and local business' kept changing to a more and more dire outlook each of the past weeks, and here are the latest updates:  :reading:

The beautiful and historic Tioga Pass Resort has met it’s match this past heavy winter……
Summer 2017 Hours & Information
Please follow us on social media for updates.

Another nearby and beautiful destination, and sometimes alternative to the TPR as well as the gateway to the Twenty Lakes Basin is:

Saddlebag Lake Resort: 
(Check out the picture on their Home Page as of July 2, 2017)  :shoveling:
2017 Opening???  With the snow accumulation this year it will be a while before we can open.  It looks like there might be some damage to the main General Store...  Until the snow melts and we are able to evaluate the facilities, we are not sure of an opening date for 2017.  (Previously they had posted anticipating an opening at END of July)

As much as I miss being able to go up there, and actually being there, I guess I’m not actually missing much……  :sing:


Eastern Sierra Forum / Re: Snow in the backcountry!
« on: June 16, 2017, 04:55:43 PM »
My 2 cents worth -

Probably need to look at hikes/destinations below 9,000 ft elevation if not lower.
Be VERY careful of any creek crossings, particularly with any children (i.e. avoid at all costs, not worth the risk)

I have never been, however some of the others on this board have posted great Trip Reports to the Davis Lake/Hilton Lakes Basin, particularly for early season hiking and for younger kids as well.........perhaps one of the group will be able to add to this suggestion.  There are two options from the Rock Creek Lake area and one longer but direct route up out of Crowley Lake Area.

Not far up northbound on 395 the McGee Creek Trail might be a possibility and if I am not mistaken there might be a beaver pond visible along the way.  If there is, the beavers might likely be very busy (no pun intended) protecting or rebuilding their habitat from the high runoff.

I am sure that many others will be able to share suggestions based on real experience. 

And remember, the sun's reflection off of the snow and water will be brutal - use the Highest Protection Level Sunscreen very liberally applied, Sunglasses, Hats, Mosquito Repellent and of course, Start and STAY Hydrated. (And all of the other precautions Mom and Dad used to tell you about.   :campfire: :cold: :rain: :lightning:)

Have a great trip!  All the best, P A C    :hiking2:

Eastern Sierra Fishing / Re: Float Tubing 101
« on: May 04, 2017, 10:12:39 AM »
Congrats on the equipment and the consecutive number of days you will be able to enjoy both the equipment and the beautiful area!

Not at all intending to be a 'Debbie Downer', simply out of an abundance of caution, I'm offering the following suggestions for your maximum safety and enjoyment by starting off the right way.  June Lake, Silver Lake and Grant Lakes in particular can experience very heavy winds.

As you have stated this is your first time, I would STRONGLY encourage you to start the trip off with a lesson specific to float tubing in the Eastern Sierras from an experienced and licensed local Fly Fishing Guide.  This is primarily for your safety, as well as to maximize your time and efforts.  They can teach you safety under their supervision, and also provide you with technical instruction and the latest inside info on where to fish in each of the Loop Lakes and what to use.

The water will be very, very cold due to the extended spring run off, you will need to wear appropriate layers of thermal clothing underneath your waders.  It is not summertime at the beach :-).  In a similar late, heavy winter year I have 'wet' waded late in the month of June in RCL at the inlet, in shorts and water up to my upper thighs, and within 15 minutes began to shiver uncontrollably. 

There have been several instances of mishap, hypothermia and even deaths that have occured from inexperienced float tubers not being knowledgeable of what and how to prepare for water temps, weather conditions, etc.  There is at least one post thread in the archives of this board of an unfortunate man that lost his life on RCL when the float tube he was using in questionable weather conditions flipped over from a heavy wind gust and he was unable to 'right' himself upwards. His son posts his thanks and appreciation to all that attempted to assist his father in the middle of the lake, however it was too late.

Again, my suggestion is not at all to discourage you but to ensure that you get off to a great, safe and knowledgeable start to you your fist experience float tubing and added benefit from it for the long run.

Have a safe trip and lots of fun!  P A C

Eastern Sierra Forum / Re: Request RCL Info
« on: April 19, 2017, 12:08:51 PM »
Sorry I don't have (but probably now should) have the following phone numbers or URL links, but would encourage to you to 'Google' or otherwise research and contact the following and ask each of them the questions:

 - USDA Forest Service White Mountain Ranger Station/District Office in Mammoth Lakes

 - Mono County Department of Transportation/Roads/ or etc - County Seat is in Bridgeport, Mono County, CA
 - - Search for a Sub Station at Sherwin Grade, or nearby.

 - Call Tom's Place and see if they have any info from employees that work for above agencies that might frequent their Restaurant/Bar

 - Call Rock Creek LODGE (not Resort)

And if fortunate enough, we might hear first hand from Scout who has first hand knowledge and likely contacts at all of the above.

Best of Luck - and Be Safe on Sunday

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